Discussion in 'Legal' started by bossland, Sep 13, 2014.
A terms of service is a contract, in this case it is called a clickwrap which is a completely legal form of contract used by hundreds of thousands of companies all over the world.
DaSoul, even if someone does reverse engineer, in order to understand the code, you are wrong with your statement.
The European Court of Justice already made its point in 2012
Judgement of the Court
Reverse Engineer is allowed.... no idea where you get your facts from.
You may read through it, law is interesting.
I'm with everyone else for the most part, if HB goes away, I don't see a point in playing the game anymore. If I have to control something, I'd rather just play an FPS. Botting WoW is just something I do because I still kinda enjoy playing the economy on my server and doing the occasional arena match. Outside of that I don't care for the crap the game has become.
I just don't understand how Blizzard fails to see how beneficial the bots actually are. I play on a dead server almost. AH was always so dry (and I hate farming myself) that it took me 3 weeks to level JCing to 300 (before I started botting) buying everything from the AH. I use a multitude of chars to post auctions so it doesn't look like 1 person is basically controlling every market, but my efforts make sure that PvE and PvP players always have access to pots, flasks, feasts, gems, enchants, BoE Craftables, etc. Additionally, I run 2 grouped healers and 1 geared dps in BGs on ally to help ally win BGs more often on my BG. Obviously what little I do is trivial to the number of players on a merged realm, but I've never had anyone complain to me about having 2 healers, both with top healing, and 1 dps with top Dmg, helping to carry undergeared players in BGs. When it comes to the AH, I get only thanks from my server. People are always sending me notes for taking the time to make sure the AH is always stocked with whatever they need to do whatever they want at more than reasonable prices, (@Blizzard) and this is all thanks to Honorbuddy!
yes blizzard should be happy with all the way that this bot will work for someone like myself that is handicapped and cannot use a keyboard and mouse like everyone else. besides the farming things and all the other things this bot does. the most thing I use this for is key pressing it lets me control the character movement myself and the bot controls the combat routine for me so that I can play their game and I am sure many other folks beside myself are in the same situation. you don't have to use this to just make money or sell gold it helps handicapped people and it in turn will generate more money for blizzard in the long run. also I would not be able to play this game without your bot and I will definitely quit if they were to close you down. thanks for a great product and helping handicapped people like myself. keep fighting this for us all
thats right without this bot i wouldnt be able to be in top arena pvp healing or pve raid dps healing without this bot i would just play another game i only use the bot for automation rotation and i move my self i dont use it for farming or something il do that my self im just not as good to do the rotation my self
all bots by bossland does not ruin games, it helps us play the game and even farm it, if it wasn't for the bot, i wouldn't even play the whole game...
the game is too complicated to play without a bot, bots are helping us play ( it's not hacking the game, neither hacking users ) it just plays like the rest of the players
so why make a big deal of it?
Blizzrad must stop fucking around... coz they will lose many many many ppl who bot/pay to play....
Keep it up guys.. I for one will not play wow if the bot goes down. I don't use it to make gold only for personal use.
Same here tbh, I wouldn't play anymore if it wasn't for this bot... and surely I wouldn't pay for multiple accounts and have fun with them.
Also while in my case is just laziness/entertainment, I know of some people with disabilities that rely on the bot to raid/play and without it they wouldn't be able to, that is just to show how HB can do some good.
too bad to hear. Sounds like a pretty though defeat even on the cases you thought you might win.
It feels like I will never see the "quest" option in my hb again
Is there any hope for german user to get all features back?
Sounds like a pretty dodge of the cases essence from yourself mate?
Excuse me, but where have you recognized defeat?
the only reason i am subbed to wow is this bot else i wouldnt be playing the game, blizzard will lose player numbers from this in my opinion, it wouldnt surprise me if like 250,000-500,000 players quit out of the 6.7 million? and they need the subs after watering down the game because it was on a peak of 12 million?
250-500k players it isnt a crazy wild number in my opinion its quite realistic, 1/3 of the players i play with use a bot, i join so many instances with BG's and instances with botters and see them at grind spots all the time i know they are botting because i am botting.
blizzard have already made the game extremely casual (easy) lfg raid wise, extremely easy leveling wise, grinding for rep etc is ultimately pointless, it just takes time so who cares if you do it manually or not, you cant bot to win arena, you have rated bg's for serious competitive bg's, the only way i see a bot harming the game is by gold farming but everyone has tons of gold anyway, you get like 8k after finishing leveling a character, the game is naturally flooded with gold anyway, thats why stuff costs so much and mount skills cost a ton because gold is naturally inflated by there own game design, i dont know if you can hardcore raid on a bot but i would imagine it would struggle, even if its possible thats the users decision, the guilds decision and who cares its only pve gear that is replaced in a few months.
no harmful impact is done, it actually keeps people on the game in my opinion. a full character boosts to max level is pure cheating in my opinion you press one button and bam, instant win, it also kills leveling/grinding population and makes the game world even deader but i suppose that isnt classed as cheating as blizzard make money.
You do prolly forget, that some of us maintain more than 1 wow license, a lot of people here do bot with 5-10-20 bots in the same time, which reflects to double or even more botted accounts than the botters themselves in total.
Sorry for my messy English
Some user said that they would not play anymore without HB and that is the opionion that the court understand. They do not believe in the forum posts by Blizz.
But it will be interesting what happens next. Diablo was bannend because of influence the economy. But now there are nothing anymore to influence. What happens after they lose their? Contract discussion is interesting, too. Now Bossland dont have any licences anymore. So can they continue working on the programm? Is that the courts answer to the question: In what relationship ( Contract ) stands Bossland to Blizzard?
The whole point is that botting isn't illigal the sale of their bots is that's what blizzard is trying to prove.
Using every argument possible that is as rediculous as possible.
i really enjoy the the game and watching my toon, but i cannot do one more rotation after all these years. if HB goes, wow goes for me as well once and for all.
Couldnt have said it any better.
The problem itself is a bit more complex. You have to see the edge cases. How would wow be without any form of automation, how would it be if everybody had access to it.
If there wasn't any form of automation you could imagine, that prices would drop a lot. People do not like to farm. At the same time, people that rely on the automation for other purposes then farming might even lose their ability to play. This is probably a big loss in subscription, since you wouldn't have all those bot accounts anymore and all people with disabilities would vanish aswell.
If everyone had access too it, then it would be very hard to keep the economy balanced. You would have a lot more bots, but the aesthetics of the game might be a bit retarded, when you see afk-fighting people everywhere. Rarely anyone doing his own rotation anymore and so on.
I wish a compromise would star to appear in the botters community in a way, that they do not touch the auction house. This is the biggest impact you can make. Be it AH Sniping or just unloading tons of materials in most of the AH cases there is only one loser and that is the player without bot and it creates tension.
I don't believe blizzard would actually give a shit if all the botters could do would be to generate gold via npc (pickpocketing or whatever method that doesn't involve the AH) and then transfer that gold to someone so he can buy whatever he wants.
I understand, that they need to take a stance though and I actually like it happening. That botting zone has to be brought to the law, while I hope in favor of bossland, I still hope that some restrictions will stay in place. It is just annoying, that you do not know where the legality ends.
If you do not believe me, then flesh out a proper business plan and bring it to a bank and try to explain to them, that it really isn't illegal to bot, because technically there isn't a precedence yet - it is just against the ToS and see if you get your funding approved.
I did my best to get it through the bank, but the last station failed. I got it through a lot of other stages though to make a proper firm like bossland, also in germany and ready to take a stance in front of the court to create presedences. Well funding just got slowed down, that is all.
One thing I do know. When Blizzard took down Glider in the courts back in 2009, Activision/Blizzard had the backing of an ancient French company called Vivendi. They pulled out last year 2013 and have left Blizz on theyre own. If the courts are really ruled by the conglomerates and the freemasons, then maybe this time they want to break WoW (let HB live) in order to bring in the next new money maker. Courts and lawmakers are all corrupt, it might save you this time.
here is a link to the evil:
Vivendi sells another $850 million in Activision Blizzard stock | Polygon
you guys prolly think i'm nuts man but the world is insane, i'm just a part of this merry go round
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